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WWYD

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Eric Tscherne	WWYD	Lead	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 151 Aug 6 07 9:16 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	What Would YOU do? I have a unique insiders perspective. Because of being on the inside I can also sometime sNOT see the obvious. It's a double edged sword. I have tried to communicate the often complex issues regarding how a diecast car is made, marketed and priced to you the collector. Recently we've seen a whole lot of: I would do this or I would do that. So I'd like to get some collector input on what they would do if they owned the JL brand. How would you grow the sales? How would you appeal to NEW customers? How would you combat the high cost of production and the desire for lower prices? I'd like to hear everything you've got to sya. No thought is a bad one! I think this wcould be a unique way for us to discuss the future of JL. One thing, Let's try and not re-hash the old problems unless we are bringing something new to the equation. Let's keep it positive just as positive as it would be if you were appointed CEo of JL and it was your first day....WWYD?
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velocitystudios	Re: WWYD	#1	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 179 Aug 7 07 7:12 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	1) How would you grow sales? 2) How would you appeal to new customers? 3) How would you combat the high cost of production and desire for low prices? I will answer the questions in reverse. Determine precisely what your vision is, listen to your core markets concerns ABOUT THE PRODUCT, decide what your largest most profitable market share will be and cater to the largest chuck of that pie first whiners and crybabies who have their underwear in a bunch because they cant see the detail in the seatbelt buckles can go take a hike. Main objective : START A DIECAST WAR. I would retail my cars for $1.49. Period. Metal base and body. Plastic interior and glass. 2 - 3 hard plastic mag-wheel types. Very minimal extra tampo or extra colors (no silver painted trim). Paint colors I would go back to the PlayArt school of color selection and use whatever you got, buy extras and remnent paints cheap (mix your own) close enough in color for a particular car is fine with me. Generic one size bubble card packaging. 2-3 color inks. No varnishes. No UV coatings. No holograms. 3). I would do my due dilligence and review who on this earth can do the work the cheapest. I would consider sourcing all my production in Mexico, Guatemala and South America as they are quickly becoming the best alternate to Asia and as well with the very latest in technology. Many businesses (including industries related to my own profession printing and graphic arts) are moving to South America (Brazil, Argentina etc) as the cost of labor is cheap and raw materials are aplenty. As well, shipping logistics and a very competitive labor force (cut-throat and willing to bend over backwards). As well, South American manufactuers are quite adept and agile in their factories being able to switch over at the drop of a hat multi task different products ( a scissors company that also produces die-cast cars for example). I would incorporate in Sau Palo Brazil. Staff here in my US Office in East Santa Ana, CA. would be 3. All of them would speak, read and write fluent Spanish. One will be a business and marketing legal lawyer. Further in the battle of high cost, I would immediately eliminate fluff and frills packaging and other frills garbage. Standardize as much as possible in both production and packaging. 2). Appeal to new customers simply with low prices ($1.49). 40 new castings a year (stolen castings, borrowed castings etc). Absolutely nothing else. LISTEN, READ AND HEED WHAT THE CUSTOMERS ARE SAYING ABOUT THE PRODUCT AND ACT ACCORDINGLY. Other than that, no personal contact, no reps talking to folks on discussion boards. Keep all info very quiet. Only what folks need to know: where to get the product. I think that less info is a good thing so long as the product can be found. I would however have my US staff (and dilberately planted "disgruntled and angry former staff") plant very limited rumors, hoaxes, lies and spin on discussion boards regarding so called rare cars and variations. Let the collectors do the rest as they feed off this and speculate of the spin as this creates the feeding frenzies. As well, create odd variations of the castings (the wheels for example, 2 of the 3 types would be common, the last would be the rare variation. Same with colors. Create a fake rare color. Same with interiors. But again outside of the planted info of your staff, SHARE NO PRODUCTION INFORMATION OR #s WITH ANYBODY. The only phone calls answered will be either production or vendors. Angry customers can listen to the canned thank you recording. 1). Grow sales? Mass saturation. Chop your competition off at the ankles. In addition to the mass outlets, I would actually target all the 2nd tier mass marketers too. I would then target other retail venues (dimestores, 7-11, Checker Auto Parts, grocery chains, farm and feed stores, party supply stores). As well, on your packaging - especially in other countries that sell your cars - make specious and ambigious claims on your packaging as well as other products like cereal boxes and pototo chips bags as your product is better than other brands (be very vague) and vaguely explain why the other brands are inferior. HEAVILY EMPHASIZE LOW COST of your brand vs what the other guys are ripping you off blind for. Claim that the other brands could be dangerous! Start who is better wars with the other brands. Outright lies are OK, but make sure that these you can hide them in interperative "language barrier issues" (that these are claimed in other far away countries will make it difficult to leagally prosecute) Make a concerted effort to re-create the no holds barred brand rivalrys of the 60s. Time to play hardball. This is my honest answer.
Mark Hosaflook	Re: WWYD	#2	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 7 07 7:32 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I know this is a JL thread but permit to use as example the Motor Max format as a sample of how I would do it and in this case how they are doing it. Their price point is still well below 2.99 so that is not an issue. They found their niche to get people interested by doing the casting nobody else would touch causing others to reconsider that part of the market and in fact also try these castings as well. I think they are but two things away from causing lots of problems for other's in the industry. Based on the success of the program I assume the cost to quality ratio is NOT an issue so I would implemnt the following two items to the table. 1. As much as I hate to admit it, a Chase Car system needs to be adopted. Red tires, red base, whatever it is, I think that creating that type of frenzy and element to their formula would place it amoung the other "collector" series. 2. Continuing with the odd man out casting is fine but releases need to be more forthcoming. Even if half the release is simply a color change from before. Perhaps a six car format. Three castings new and new colors for three other castings on each release. With the present pricing, quality and these two added formats I not only see it as possible but probable as well. With the way numbers have been played with for the past ten years who really cares about "only 5000". Proof is in the pudding when t=HW probably kicks out millions of Barris Batmobiles yet none are found on pegs. "Numbers" are highly over-rated! That's it in a nutshell and most of it is already in place now.
velocitystudios	Re: WWYD	#3	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 179 Aug 7 07 7:40 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	"Numbers are highly overated" Agreed strongly. Easily the biggest con of them all, second to the other shell game "limited edition adult collectable"... Tootsie-pop anybody?
Eric Tscherne	Ok So	#4	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 151 Aug 7 07 9:18 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Glad to see this finially got kicked off! OK so you want to target mass market? but HOW? what would be different? I like the idea of an all metal car at 1.49 but that car would end up allot more like a hot wheels car rather then a JL. To make that price work allot of the extras, 2 piece wheels, opening hoods and allot of the trim paint that seperates a JL from a HW would end up on the cutting room floor. Maybe the new sourcing could help. Just to let you all know I've tred to build that product at least 3 times in the last 6 years. No one was able to help me out China/Taiwan/Malaysia all came up short of delivering. Cheap packaging is a good idea though with licensing today you almost always are stuck creating an individual card per car due to leagal lines and licensor requirements. Packaging is a much bigger componet of time and effort then it was in the past and in my opinion then it should be today. While many collectors do not open their products for fear of loosing value the intent is always to free the cars as they are just way cooler out int he open. The small staff is a good idea but 3 is sorta real small. My guess is you are looking at 5-10 people. 1/2 would be sales the rest are involved int he business and product development areas. You need a project manager to coordinate the development of new castings and decos. You probably need one guy handeling the numbers. The Legal side can be vended out but you would still need someone to locate, and track down new licenses and work with the existing OEM licenses. Over time you'd need a few more development people as this new streamlined product ould eventually need to be face lifted. On average you get about a 2 year run out of a successfull product int he toy world then it's time to overhaul, repositions and improve. All good ideas coming...Does Made in the USA matter? would it help?
Mark Hosaflook	Re: Ok So	#5	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 7 07 12:28 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Does "Made in USA" matter? It would to me had that market still been in force the past 20 or so years but I think our economy has long ago given up on the small toy assembly line in the US so I think to me at least, it's a moot point.
Mark Hosaflook	Re: WWYD	#6	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 7 07 1:13 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	If nobody out there was able to make a quality die-cast under 2.99 I'd have no issue with the other prices for JL and GL. Actually I have noticed that there are many, MANY more HW's blue card casting and especially Matchbox castings that are still under the 1.00 range that I feel make the mark as well. Many of those HW's still have die-cast bottoms too and when they go on sale, still offer a .60 value. I see plenty of 1:43rd scale cars selling for under the 4.99 price point as well and material cost on those not to mention shipping have to be more than 1:64th. To address your three points more directly. 1. Take the MM formula but add the two tweaks mentioned in my above thread. 2. I fault the question. The customers are there already looking for an alternative now. Build it and THEY will come, I think. 3. Cut out this specialty blister you say legal and license has such a heavy hand in forcing on us. I have a hard time thinking that HAS to be a fact based on the HW's blue card, Matchbox card and on a premium side the MM blister that is top quality yet generic. Less size, less weight in shipping, less space taken on the Wally aisle as they like that too. Either conform to generic size or go small allowing for more space to sell other stuff. 4. My product would reach other areas left vastly alone. Think more along the lines of period correct items that cars hauled...........like wooden Cris craft boats, camper trailers, weekend warrior race trailers etc. Not a bass boat series, not an off scale Ski-doo or boogie boards. Be the leader.........not trying to cash in on another's hot idea hoping there's enough coin and interest to keep your coat-tail efforts afloat.
Eric Tscherne	Re: WWYD	#7	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 151 Aug 7 07 5:38 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	HW blue card and Matchbox cars are in fact individual now. The front used to have a black plate change for the car name but they dropped that 5 years or more ago. Now each front is technically unique though they use a common template. Notice the variations for series, and the occasional choke warning(looks like a sticker but is usually not!) or the moving Mattel Wheels, Gaurateed for Life, or Metal Collection logos. Occasionaly ,particularly with Hummer and Chrysler they require specific type faces or logos for car identification. You can see this best on Jada product. On the back the legal lines are constantly in flux. You also see that the cross sell varies from card to card. The days of one package for every car are over. Tru though a more simple approach could work better. A good example is Jada or MM where the back is common from series to series (wave or release) and they use an insert or sticker to identify the car. However this costs a tad bit more depending on complexity. This allows them to identify each car in a relase and design in solutions to logos and type face requirements by the licensor. Collector products are usually MORE scrutinized as HW are sold to kids who don't care but collectibles are sold to potential customers in the eyes of the OEMs/ The collectors are there. Statisitally seaking they are not. Not enough to support the people making them. Somehow you've got to increase the collector base. One thing to also note the Build it and they will come model is interesting and in theory should work but at mass retail you've got about 30 days for thousands to have to come or the item ends up closing out never to be seen again. Mass is the foundation for most of the lines that work today. It funds the new castings and any marketing, websites and such. HW w/ metal bases: At least 80% of new HW casting are 1/2 plastic. Some are plastic bodied! yep, like the Acceleracers. I would actually bet the number is closer to 90%. Occasionally you'll get a metal/metal car but usually at the sacrifice of the interior or other part. at the end of the day you have about 35 grams of metal to work with in as many parts as you want so long as it ends up at 35grams or less. This was as of 05 it could be less today. In 2002 basic cars were about .35 incluuding the package. in 2004 that figure was 26.5 cents. I have heard the number was close to 35cents today. this is almost purely due to cost of materials. The cheapo companies making 1/43rds for 4.99 and cheap diecast generally have less invested in every facet. They use the cheapest factories. You know, the ones you see on TV with the bucket for a toilet. They also have ZERO advertising or marketing. Often they spend zilch on the web. They also have the leanest slaes and development teams often not employing anyone but some sales guys in the States. I also happen to believe that irt shows in their products! ask Jack at Jada or the crwe at Maisto what some domestic talent can do for the bottom line. Even Malibu International is using US designers. The products tend to look jut a bit better as the guys checking things have the keen eye for what works here. Sort of goes to Desert Fox's comments on another thread. Sales: for most everyone a sale means one of 2 things: A. The product is being discontinued. B. The product is being moved at a loss or at a break even to make room for new stuff. it is used as a cleansing. HW are sold for between 60-70 cents each so when you see them at 2 for a buck or .54 there is a little wheeling a dealing going on....
velocitystudios	Re: WWYD	#8	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 179 Aug 8 07 5:49 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Eric, Thanks for your input and posting this. I have no issues with these companies using the cheapest means possible to produce their product at the cost of slicing frills, fluff, cheapie extras and fat management so long as the end result is decent. That the company hasn't TV ads or a website questionaire is of no concern of mine. The common card packaging I would feircely challenge as I am somewhat experienced in standardized packaging (and printing). We have all heard stories in the past of why castings are scaled the way they are and it was for reasons that they fit a particular package; ergo I would submit then that HotWheels are done for that reason as well (for the most part; I would venture to guess that if they wanted to, they could insist on a standard blister size and it would work fine. That you had asked upon the onset to this thread that we not dredge up old issues on the price for JL, if we are then delving into issues like the cost of a blue card Hot Wheel or Matchbox and their relevant reasons they cost what they do, then we have to be intellectually honest enough then also to ask (again) why then does the JL car cost over 4.00+? Since this board is relevant to JL, reflecting on what the competition pays out to build theirs begs still the (unanswered) and horse corpse beaten question why JL charges what they do. After asking nearly 10 years, I still don't know. -Peter
Mark Hosaflook	Re: WWYD	#9	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 8 07 6:23 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Eric We must not go to the same stores or these stores must not stock the same product. The manufacturer escapes me now but they do 1:43rd scale 50's American cars, Pontiac, Cadillac, Buick, Dodge etc. They are outstanding and they come in a plastic display cubes with cardboard packaging around that. The master box is a cut out box cube as well that I think holds 24 cars. It amazes me how many people define cheapo based on price as these cars are all two tone color, metal bodies, multi-colered interiors, rubber tires and they sell for less than a GL/JL. Also around the Holidays places like Menards carries classic American iron in a slightly larger scale, maybe 1:32. Again, these are in plasitc cubes with the car name on the base with many opening door, trunk hood features. These are actually very nice, interior is multicolored, convertibles come with top up or down inserts and the engines are colored as well. These too are below a GL/JL cost and when they do the Holiday bag thing or you wait until the day after Christmas they are 33 to 50 percent off. I picked mine up for around 3.35 each. They put any 1:64 out there to shame. Castings are classics like the 812 Cord, boat tailed Auburn etc. I'm thinking maybe Sunstar but due to my cars in storage I can't be for certain. Cheapo by price but I assure you light years in quality above other smaller scale items. It seems every time actual examples are provided, adjectives are used to swiftly write them off, part of the problem is turning a blind eye to these items and continually providing a reason why they exist by the rules other manufactureres use. I say, go to THESE manufacturers to see what they can do for small scale and at what price. How many times have you heard, "I buy what I like" yes, there are so some who will be blind brand loyal but we all know those numbers are far too small to support a company's needed sales. You keep telling us WHY others can do it and why GL/JL is not and yet my dollar is going more to that side of the fence. Just for shits and giggles Eric go over to the HobbyTalk Motor Max thread and look up an old thread I did comparing a .49 Motor Max casting to a 4.99 JL. It's on page 5 I think titled "Can you tell the difference between the .50 and 4.99 car?" The only addition I added to the .49 car was better wheels and tires and that was done to showcase how a small investment in something like higher grade wheel/tire combo can make a huge difference. Since you know the cost of these wheels and tires, I'll let you tell us just how much that uprade would add to the cost of the .49 car. Both cars were Euro supercars, both were purchased around the same date as well.
Eric Tscherne	Re: WWYD	#10	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 151 Aug 8 07 10:48 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Mark, The itmes you are usin as examples all have thier own specific reasons for being: Motormax: It's Wal-Mart's house brand (or was) for the MOST part their only retail outlet is Wal-Mart, the distribution numbers alone at Wal-Mart could make a tiny operation profitable but consider that they vend out a little design domestically then turn EVERYTHING over to China and that is how they do it. I know that MM is popping up at other places now but you'll likely never see them in Target or K-Mart due to the Wally relationship. The Cheapo 1/43rds and others: There are 2 issues associated with this the common package and the price I'll adress each seperately: 1. Common package: It appears common. Likely it is produced like a 1/24th package. Each car gets the same box. It is possible that all the legal lines are contained on the single package. When you have all of the cars from one licensee this can be very easy (GM for example). Usually a sticker is used to identify the specific car on a plinth or insert possibly directly on the front window. This is how we did the LRG scale JLFT cars. It's also been utilized by Muscle Machines on their all of their stuff. Licnsors often require the specific font or logo to use as the identifier. You see this mostly with current makes and models and really depends on how the specifc brand is promoting their models. Nissan requires a specific font for Nissan as a word. Plymouth does as well. GM is flexible but with Hummer of thenew Camaro they specified use of the actual fonts. 2. Price: The stuff being brought in near Christmas is just what it appears: Seasonal. These are seasonal price grabs by the buyers. They can get a huge discount by loading up usually directly from a factory rather then a middle man (Mattel, Jada, RC2, etc.) The price drops as you near the holiday and it closes out quickly. It's easy for the factory to produce this stuff as they generally produce 20-30K of the same decos rather then the lower quantities that collectors want and that are needed to keep inventory turning at the right intervals. This stuff is just like the water toys that come in each year in the late spring and by 4th of July are on close out. The factories making this stuff slam it together and ship it all at once it's very quick and cheap. One issue with no Website, Marketing or PR is that you esentially loose the BRAND. Most of the collectors here at Joe's are partial to a brand. People collect JL, HW or Jada. few people collect a sampling of everything. For RC2 JL was always about the brand. Today they are exploring the far reaches of what that brand could mean to consumers and what it means to different consumers. I'm not saying it's right. We had a hard time launching JLFT most here wanted Foose in the regular JL style. 1Badd Ride has had similar issues launching their brand and I would also suggest that very few diecast collectrs are familiar with GL (this is changing) based on the limited number of postings they get on their own board here at Joe's. When we overhauled the line we essenially focused on collectors. We were forced into a footprint for the package. All diecast 2.99 and up had to be in a common footprint for WalMart by the spring of 07. If you look at it Jada, Malibu, JL, and Maisto all take up the same space on a peg. The actual shape may vary but the space is aboyt 6" wide x 7" high per teir retailer guidlines. it makes the isle easier to shop and allows them to rotate in and out the best sellers and the worst can easily disapear mid season without resetting the pegs. We focused in on the best themes from our research and sales history, We knew that cost was going up so we put some additional effort into the trading cards and standardized the package as uch as we could balancing the licensors' guidlines and those of Wal-Mart wth our our gut feelings and tried to keep it flexible so that as new themes were created or new castings came into the line taht they could be incorporated fairly easily. It's not a .99 cent car so we paid for the color on the back. Though with the clamshell (also something that is gently pushed for by the retailers) we were able to utilize a thinner card stock saving a few fractions of a cent. The clam does add cost. though it's minimal and while we did entertain a completely retro pacakge (craft back, classic limited ink appearing front and a blister) it was ultimately the retailers whom decided the clam was a better appearing package for their stores. Unfortuanatley the business is not independant but interdependant. You've got to work with the retailers if you hope to have success. More to come but I have a meeting to hit.
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Mark Hosaflook	Re: WWYD	#11	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 8 07 12:21 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	OK now I'm confused. You asked how each of us would do it. I gave some examples how I would then gave actual documented proof it's possible and then you defend an answer like an employee. You asked.....I offered and I didn't expect a counter as to why it can't work for JL. Regarding MM. They are everywhere I find JL's at including Toy Liquidators. I think they are now Meijers house brand and Maisto is Wallys. Being anybody's house brand helps cut production costs on volume so I'm not sure that's a bad thing either. I would think being a house brand also guarantees certain shelf space rights as well AND they also manufacture to those who don't....like GL. Eric, I'm PRO JL, really. I've toiled for years for that brand, seen the highs, seen the lows, been a hero, been a dog but no matter what, if asked a question, didn't matter if it was Tom Lowe, Tom Ramey, Tom Zahorsky.....I'm going to give an honest answer. If there were no issues Eric, this thread would not exist, right?
Mark Hosaflook	Re: WWYD	#12	[-]
Diecast Fanatic Posts: 344 Aug 8 07 12:31 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Also Eric I think you miss on one very major point. You say people here at Joe's and other locations are brand specific. If so why is this not Joe's JL Shack? Most people on this site collect many brands and this may be a key reason why JL hss missed the mark the past three years thinking JL collectors will only buy JL product and can kick out the Post, X-men, Frankenstein and it will sell. You are wrong. I find they are far more casting loyal. Need proof. I bet the MM Mustang outsells the Vega 3 to 1. I bet if they did a Camaro next month you'd have a hard time finding it on the pegs. Think the Camaro guy cares if it's JL. Hell no especially if it's half the price and the quality is good. Think I'm wrong, go look at the starved Olds guy. Hell they'll buy anything they are so starved. Think they care if it says RC2 on the bottom? I really feel the whole mind set has you guys looking for the hey maker while your chest gets rabbit punched to death from all this "liitle stuff" out there.
Pliskin	WWYD	#13	[-]
VP of Toys, Inc. Posts: 899 Aug 8 07 1:23 PM Diecast Metal Head Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	ll keep this short a possible 1.Make every new product cool, unique and better then the rest in at least one way (i.e. better wheels or paint or trim). Maybe sell separate diecast accessories like small jack stands, people, gas pumps, lifts, trailers, Christmas trees, etc, of the same scale to allow people to mix and match (like they do in train sets). Make it so you can build your own unique city piece by piece. Key to this is the accessories must cost the same as the diecast car and be sold seperately. I'd also love to see some stamped steel bodies on diecast bases. 2.There is no way to appeal to new customers. Customers will find the diecast, the diecast does not find the customer. Now, its a different story if what you mean by new customer is one you are trying to bring over from another brand. In which case refer to the first sentence of #1. 3.As far as combating cost. Id put them in a small cardboard box with the picture of the car printed on the outside and seal them in cellophane just like the old MB came. Retailers would display an example in a #d case for viewing and customers would need to ask for them by #. If you get lucky and get a chase then lucky you. Everybody would have the same odds of getting a chase car. This would stop hoarding/scalping because they could not be hidden in the store, scalped by insiders or returned after opening just like CD/DVDs. Dang I'm good! I should be running the show over there. Remember me when these ideas put you guys on top;)
armataz	Re: WWYD	#14	[-]
VP of Toys, Inc. Posts: 568 Aug 8 07 1:43 PM My Friends call me Taz Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	*Quote:* have tried to communicate the often complex issues regarding how a diecast car is made, marketed and priced to you the collector. Recently we've seen a whole lot of: I would do this or I would do that. So I'd like to get some collector input on what they would do if they owned the JL brand. Q:How would you grow the sales? A:.cut costs,increase production, use the added sales to increase profit. Q:How would you appeal to NEW customers? A: cut the price back to 2 bucks a car where you started. Q:How would you combat the high cost of production and the desire for lower prices? A:increase production per unit, reduce package size, advertise to kids. I'd like to hear everything you've got to sya. No thought is a bad one! I think this wcould be a unique way for us to discuss the future of JL. One thing, Let's try and not re-hash the old problems unless we are bringing something new to the equation. Let's keep it positive just as positive as it would be if you were appointed CEo of JL and it was your first day....WWYD? low production might be great for collectability and the secondary market. but the higher retail prices is not helping your companies bottom line.if it reduces sales of your products.TAZ
Wyatt D	....	#15	[-]
Experienced Collector Posts: 42 Aug 8 07 1:47 PM Experienced Collector Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The biggest problem with the JL brand right now is distribution. I think the differtentiation is great. Let Jada do what they do, they do it very well I might add, let the larger scale manufacturers do what they do, and let Mattel do the $1 line. The closest competition right now for JL is GreenLight. All others do not offer the same style for a similar price. I understand JL has limited (probably very limited) power to force retail outlets to carry their product. There needs to be some programs in effect that protect the retailers if certain series or sets don't sell over time. A timeline for rejects needs to be established in order to keep new sets on the shelves. This has costs, but so does having thousands of cases sitting in warehouses and no retailers buying them. Offering retailers protection gives them an insurance for the precious shelf space. You mention finding new customers and that is not easy. If it was easy, everyone would be in the business. Not many people over 30 are going to jump into collecting any time soon. If they are interested, they'd be here already. This leaves existing customers and a younger generation. For existing diecast buyers, most people's collections grow and lose value, they are reluctant to buy more. There are thousands of Hotwheel collectors wishing they could sell what they have for quarters on the dollar now. Nothing since the mid 70's seems to hold much value anymore. Most has lost value over time. The under 30 crowd interested in diecast is probably a small percentage of the overall diecast buyer and some probably jump out of the hobby as quickly as they jumped in. Where am I going with this? I think what would be the better benefit is to steal existing collectors away from other brands. In business, statistically, this is one of the hardest things to do. How would I do it? Presence, presence, presence. I'd set up at various toy fairs and trade shows anywhere I could. I'd employ a competent staff to do just that. Arm them with some giveaways, questionaires, insider information, and let them bring some people over. Presence is a huge deal, get the name out there. Erik, you mentioned the "brand" but to have that brand, people must know it's there. The next thing I would do is take care of the existing customer base with promotions. For so many proofs of purchase, the customer can purchase things using credit in the store. Making the customer feel JL is as loyal as the collector could go a long way in keeping the customer base. Use the tools available like the internet to interface and listen to what the customer is saying. That's all I can think of right now. I think the latest offerings have been great, but they are not benefitting anyone sitting boxed up in warehouses.
Eric Tscherne	devils advocate	#16	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 151 Aug 8 07 2:32 PM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Mark, Just playin' Devil's Advocate here. I am throwing at everyone the same things that were thrown back at me each time I brought a similar idea to the plate, be it at HW, Jada or RC2. With that, I am trying to show that it's not as simple as it appears to be. With everything intertwined it's hard to isolate certain things as the cause for everything going wrong. I also have noted there is a continuing trend of similar ideas to those I've seen before. Unfotunately those formulas have not worked well recently and a small tweak to the formula is going to go overlooked by most retailers. This has been the struggle for JLFT and I am betting what is holding GL back from truly exploding. I hope by throwing the various curveballs out that someone finds a way to knock one out of the park. Maybe I am derailing my own thread?!?!? As for collectors being Brand specific, I don't see how you could argue the point. Rarely do I see a post from you outside of the JL board and a few on the ED board. The same can be said for most of us here, no many HW guys frequent the JL board and even less Jada guys I'd bet the flipside to that is truer then not. We have a natural tendacy to gravitate towards the products we like the best. We end up liking more then the product and thus the Brand gains life. Your work on LF is a credit to that. It's those efforts that often make somone choose yet anoher JL or HW over some johnny come lately product. Now true, some collectors are less brand specific. Some collectors are car specific netting any Camaro or VW they see and there are many more ways to split us up. In the end there are far more Jada Fiends or HW Collectors or JL fans then there are just general "ecclectic collectors" to use Joe as an example. Unfortunaely for us all, the collector is a consumer to the manufacturers rather then a customer. The customers are Wal-Mart, Target, One Stop, etc. It forces one to look at the equation differently. That is often why even when we say target the customer, listen to the customer, etc. it regularly appears that we don't. That idea can't be further from the truth. It's perspective. Now I am sure someone will say that if collector's are Wal mart's Customers and Wal-Mart is Mattel's customer then the collector is also Mattel's customer. Not so from the other end. The collector's money ends up in the retailer's hands. The retailer's money goes in the manufacturer's hands. I also know this makes zero sense but few people look past the hand that feeds them. My cat's don't care about wear I get the food only that i give it to them.... I have long advocated a paradigm shift needs to occur in diecast. We have not seen a big shift since Jada changed the marketplace. Prior to that is was probably the segmentation of Hot Wheels mainline. We need to approach the market differently. The old ideas are not working. There are not enough collectors buying enough product to get a good deal on production thus we get higher prices. We see way to much of the same things ont he pegs. The pegs are turning over less and people are moving on and finding other hobbies, SEE Joe's DOTW from last week for that lengthy discussion. Kids only seem to play with cars from 2-5 with very few continuing beyond 6 or 8. At some point there will be no one left to buy these products. The collector get's older and less new collectors come into the hobby. Somehow the product has to become cool again. It has to be percieved differently by the masses or I fear that things will continue to erode.
armataz	Re: devils advocate	#17	[-]
VP of Toys, Inc. Posts: 568 Aug 8 07 3:02 PM My Friends call me Taz Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	hi eric, strictly speaking as a collector of cars. I have no loyalty at all to JL except to the dusters and demons JL produces. I'm speaking as a non partial consumer. since I can take or leave jonny lightning as a whole. I have no biase twards the product line. their nice cars sure, I even baught some other models I like, besides the dusters and demons. but the pricing is turning me away from even those now. your loyal customers you'll have and they will stand by you longer, those like me... we will walk away freely. something to considder when factoring in the dirrection you take the line. TAZ
travis1960	Re: devils advocate	#18	[-]
VP of Toys, Inc. Posts: 3712 Aug 8 07 4:52 PM Fairfield, TX Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	*Quote:* by Eric Tscherne My cat's don't care about wear (where) I get the food only that i give it to them.... I like that line. How about this..... I don't care where I get my Johnny Lightning's as long as I can afford them ($2.99). Bad eBay seller alert! Username - raceforhire - Beware!
Pliskin	WWYD	#19	[-]
VP of Toys, Inc. Posts: 899 Aug 8 07 8:08 PM Diecast Metal Head Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	MADE IN THE USA! I'd pay a little extra.
velocitystudios	Re: devils advocate	#20	[-]
Toy Car Master Posts: 179 Aug 9 07 5:07 AM Toy Car Master Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	"I don't care where I get my Johnny Lightning's as long as I can afford them ($2.99)." AND as long as I can find them.
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